Comments on: The myth of "software engineering" http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering "Now I feel like I know less about what that blog is about than I did before." Sat, 12 Sep 2026 13:46:15 +0000 http://thetarpit.org hourly 1 By: spyked http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-7799 spyked Mon, 07 Sep 2026 16:57:22 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-7799 > Motivations for replacing make range from a desire to replace make's very Unix-philosophy inspired domain-specific language for describing build rules (Unix-philosophy in the sense that it often works by coincidence, but falls over if you do something exotic, like have filenames with spaces in, or have an environment variable with the “wrong” name), By that definition of "Unix-philosophy inspired", the more naïve software engineer would be led to believe that every piece of software on this earth lies in the same category -- for example, did you ever try accessing a path containing the backslash character under Windows? That yielded some pretty lulzy results last time I tried. So at the end of the day, whether "engineering" is a null concept or not is entirely besides the point. The point is rather, that attempting to specify things and matters exhaustively, especially of the "general-purpose" kind, is an exercise in madness. And since the sane approach is to work on partial specifications, at some point you'll necessarily run into a hole somewhere which will break your machine -- yes, this discussion can be extended to bridges or whatever have you, this is also besides the point. So once you run into the proverbial hole, the cheapest approach is to work around it, which is how you get today's mess, and that's pretty much the whole story. > Motivations for replacing make range from a desire to replace make's very Unix-philosophy inspired domain-specific language for describing build rules (Unix-philosophy in the sense that it often works by coincidence, but falls over if you do something exotic, like have filenames with spaces in, or have an environment variable with the “wrong” name),

By that definition of "Unix-philosophy inspired", the more naïve software engineer would be led to believe that every piece of software on this earth lies in the same category -- for example, did you ever try accessing a path containing the backslash character under Windows? That yielded some pretty lulzy results last time I tried.

So at the end of the day, whether "engineering" is a null concept or not is entirely besides the point. The point is rather, that attempting to specify things and matters exhaustively, especially of the "general-purpose" kind, is an exercise in madness. And since the sane approach is to work on partial specifications, at some point you'll necessarily run into a hole somewhere which will break your machine -- yes, this discussion can be extended to bridges or whatever have you, this is also besides the point.

So once you run into the proverbial hole, the cheapest approach is to work around it, which is how you get today's mess, and that's pretty much the whole story.

]]> By: On open sores supply chainz « The Tar Pit http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-4073 On open sores supply chainz « The Tar Pit Thu, 20 Apr 2023 18:07:28 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-4073 [...] trigger-happy development is a bad idea regardless of the code distribution model. Engineering, [...] [...] trigger-happy development is a bad idea regardless of the code distribution model. Engineering, [...]

]]> By: spyked http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-3123 spyked Thu, 29 Sep 2022 17:53:29 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-3123 Meh. I'll readily admit (as I've in fact <a href="http://thetarpit.org/2020/on-the-hellpits-of-abstraction#comment-313" rel="nofollow">done before</a>, to little effect) there's very little sense to be made here, since indeed, there's nothing to be found on the basis of Wikipedia. The <a href="http://thetarpit.org/2016/the-myth-of-software-engineering-ii" rel="nofollow">following</a> <a href="http://thetarpit.org/2016/the-myth-of-software-engineering-iii" rel="nofollow">pieces</a> also have very little to offer, unfortunately, since they're no replacement for the raw experience one requires with the subject matter, an experience which can indeed be put into words, although I have my doubts anyone except myself could understand the words were I to write them down. Let it be known that I don't think much of the so-called rebuke either (and yes, you can attribute that to "dunning-kruger" or whatever, for all I care), but on that I shall not speak further, for its author is dead as far as I know. Who knows, maybe I'll sit down and do a full rewrite sometime. Meh. I'll readily admit (as I've in fact done before, to little effect) there's very little sense to be made here, since indeed, there's nothing to be found on the basis of Wikipedia. The following pieces also have very little to offer, unfortunately, since they're no replacement for the raw experience one requires with the subject matter, an experience which can indeed be put into words, although I have my doubts anyone except myself could understand the words were I to write them down.

Let it be known that I don't think much of the so-called rebuke either (and yes, you can attribute that to "dunning-kruger" or whatever, for all I care), but on that I shall not speak further, for its author is dead as far as I know.

Who knows, maybe I'll sit down and do a full rewrite sometime.

]]> By: spyked http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-280 spyked Mon, 23 Mar 2020 15:02:33 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-280 Although the Trilema article "<a href="http://trilema.com/2019/the-alleged-crisis-of-the-supposed-engineering-or-mistaken-identities-pantomiming-a-comedy-of-manners/" rel="nofollow">The alleged crisis of the supposed engineering, or mistaken identities pantomiming a comedy of manners.</a>" mentions this one, for some reason my MP-WP did not see any pingbacks coming its way, thus leaving me with no other option but to mention the former explicitly. My apologies to those interested for the long delay. Although the Trilema article "The alleged crisis of the supposed engineering, or mistaken identities pantomiming a comedy of manners." mentions this one, for some reason my MP-WP did not see any pingbacks coming its way, thus leaving me with no other option but to mention the former explicitly.

My apologies to those interested for the long delay.

]]> By: An early Lisp scriptlang prototype in Ada « The Tar Pit http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-74 An early Lisp scriptlang prototype in Ada « The Tar Pit Fri, 11 Oct 2019 11:36:12 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-74 [...] This document describes the result of my attempts at implementing a Lisp (more precisely a Scheme) scripting language in Ada. The effort spawned from numerous discussions in the logs1 and used a few important references2. In short, the goal is to have a Lisp interpreter that is a. small, easy to read, i.e. fits-in-head; and b. written in a sane language, sans pointers and other cockroaches inhabiting today's broken computing machines. [...] [...] This document describes the result of my attempts at implementing a Lisp (more precisely a Scheme) scripting language in Ada. The effort spawned from numerous discussions in the logs1 and used a few important references2. In short, the goal is to have a Lisp interpreter that is a. small, easy to read, i.e. fits-in-head; and b. written in a sane language, sans pointers and other cockroaches inhabiting today's broken computing machines. [...]

]]> By: The generative model of computing « The Tar Pit http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-56 The generative model of computing « The Tar Pit Fri, 11 Oct 2019 11:00:14 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-56 [...] See "The myth of software engineering". ↩ [...] [...] See "The myth of software engineering". ↩ [...]

]]> By: On the unambiguous usefulness of tools (in software and elsewhere) « The Tar Pit http://thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-45 On the unambiguous usefulness of tools (in software and elsewhere) « The Tar Pit Fri, 11 Oct 2019 10:33:37 +0000 http://wp.thetarpit.org/2015/the-myth-of-software-engineering#comment-45 [...] one of my previous essays I mentioned this rare property of software, of being "unambiguously [...] [...] one of my previous essays I mentioned this rare property of software, of being "unambiguously [...]

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